{"id":11377,"date":"2011-07-25T18:31:26","date_gmt":"2011-07-25T18:31:26","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/aidanfinn.com\/?p=11377"},"modified":"2011-07-25T18:31:26","modified_gmt":"2011-07-25T18:31:26","slug":"so-i-prefer-no-antivirus-on-hyper-v-hosts","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/aidanfinn.com\/?p=11377","title":{"rendered":"So \u2026 I Prefer No Antivirus on Hyper-V Hosts?"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><em>Waiver: What you do following reading this post is up to you.&#160; <\/em><\/p>\n<p>After my earlier post on \u201cTop Hyper-V Implementation Issues\u201d I had some feedback on my preference to keep antivirus (AV) off of the Hyper-V hosts.<\/p>\n<p>The configuration that you should have is in <a href=\"http:\/\/support.microsoft.com\/kb\/961804\" target=\"_blank\">KB961804<\/a>.&#160; That article also says what can happen if you do install AV on your hosts, not follow that guidance, and scan everything.&#160; One day you\u2019ll end up with nasty errors such as 0x800704C8, 0x80070037 or 0x800703E3 and find lots of VMs (with their business apps and data) have:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Disappeared from your Hyper-V console<\/li>\n<li>Disappeared from your VMM console<\/li>\n<li>Are not running<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>The files are still there but, damn, the VMs will not start up or appear in a management tool.&#160; That\u2019s because AV has gotten in the way and screwed up with things.&#160; I blogged about this back during the W2008 Hyper-V beta (can\u2019t find the post now) in early 2008.&#160; It happened to me.&#160; I was unlucky; I set the required exclusions and restarted the host in question (a lab machine).&#160; My VM configuration files were corrupted.&#160; The solution was the recreate the VM\u2019s and point them at the existing VHD\u2019s containing the safe OS, programs, and data.&#160; Time consuming \u2013 and how many people document\/remember their VM configurations?&#160; And come to think of it, how many businesses would be OK with their LOB applications being offline for half a day or more while admins do this?<\/p>\n<p>I learned something in 2004.&#160; There is a balancing act between security and business.&#160; Sometimes it has to swing one way, sometimes another.&#160; This is one of those cases.<\/p>\n<p>I do not trust any antivirus product completely.&#160; They are stupid assassins.&#160; They are given rules of engagement, get a target list, and they attack.&#160; But all too often, program updates, definition file updates, or dumb human operator error make mistakes.&#160; It is not unknown for one of these to reset the exception list.&#160; Yes; it has happened \u2013 and even happened recently.&#160; Do you really want one of these things to undo the necessary configurations of your Hyper-V cluster \u2013 a thing that is effectively a mainframe running many\/most\/all of your LOB applications, and putting them at risk?<\/p>\n<p>So I say: do not install AV on the parent partition or host OS.&#160; Sure, go ahead and install it in the VMs.&#160; If you can, choose an AV product that is aware of things like virtualisation and minimises redundant scanning.&#160; On the host, make sure you apply security fixes.&#160; Keep the service pack up to date.&#160; And keep the Windows Firewall running.&#160; Finally, restrict who has logon rights to the hosts.&#160; If you can, prevent the hosts from having proxy\/web access.&#160; People should never browse from a server but I just don\u2019t trust human nature.&#160; All that should secure the parent pretty well.<\/p>\n<p>Now let\u2019s get back to why you\u2019re installing AV on the parent partition.&#160; Odds are there is a security officer who has a list of things that [booming voice] \u201cmust be done to all Windows computers\u201d [\/booming voice].&#160; And if you do not do these things you will be fired!&#160;&#160; One of them is: \u201cyou must install anti virus and scan everything because Windows is a threat to life itself\u201d.&#160; Hmm, someone\u2019s been reading the SANS website again!&#160; I hate checklist security experts.<\/p>\n<p>Here\u2019s my response to that person:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>I\u2019d point them to <a href=\"http:\/\/support.microsoft.com\/kb\/961804\" target=\"_blank\">KB961804<\/a>.&#160; In fact, you might even want to show them the <a href=\"http:\/\/support.microsoft.com\/kb\/822158\" target=\"_blank\">Microsoft required exceptions list<\/a>.&#160; It says \u201crecommended\u201d in the title but try having that argument with a MSFT support engineer when your SYSVOL is corrupted!<\/li>\n<li>If they insist, then say you\u2019ll comply but you have one requirement.&#160; <em>Never say \u201cno\u201d because that\u2019s career suicide.&#160; <\/em>Give them a waiver form.&#160; This form will clearly state that you the operator\/administrator\/engineer\/consultant will not be held responsible for any corruption or loss of virtual machines because of the mandate to scan all things on the Hyper-V hosts.&#160; All responsibility will lie with the undersigned security officer \u2013 and demand their signature.&#160; Then keep a copy for yourself, give one to your boss, and one to the CIO.&#160; At least then you know who will get fired when incorrectly configured AV causes your VMs to disappear.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>It\u2019s funny; security officers are usually career politicians.&#160; And politicians do not like being nailed down to a something like that.&#160; Taking responsibility is not in a politician\u2019s nature.&#160; I bet you get your way after that.<\/p>\n<p>Maybe as a compromise, you might offer to take a host offline once in a while to perform a complete system scan of the C: drive.<\/p>\n<p>Anyway, that\u2019s my opinion on the matter.<\/p>\n<div style=\"padding-bottom: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; float: none; padding-top: 0px\" id=\"scid:0767317B-992E-4b12-91E0-4F059A8CECA8:eedb1dc7-88d4-43f8-8d9a-b392c0ca2c79\" class=\"wlWriterEditableSmartContent\">Technorati Tags: <a href=\"http:\/\/technorati.com\/tags\/Hyper-V\" rel=\"tag\">Hyper-V<\/a>,<a href=\"http:\/\/technorati.com\/tags\/Virtualisation\" rel=\"tag\">Virtualisation<\/a>,<a href=\"http:\/\/technorati.com\/tags\/Security\" rel=\"tag\">Security<\/a><\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Waiver: What you do following reading this post is up to you.&#160; After my earlier post on \u201cTop Hyper-V Implementation Issues\u201d I had some feedback on my preference to keep antivirus (AV) off of the Hyper-V hosts. The configuration that you should have is in KB961804.&#160; That article also says what can happen if you &hellip; <a href=\"https:\/\/aidanfinn.com\/?p=11377\" class=\"more-link\">Continue reading<span class=\"screen-reader-text\"> &#8220;So \u2026 I Prefer No Antivirus on Hyper-V Hosts?&#8221;<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"_monsterinsights_skip_tracking":false,"_uf_show_specific_survey":0,"_uf_disable_surveys":false,"_wpcom_ai_launchpad_first_post":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[20],"tags":[181,190,195],"class_list":["post-11377","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-hyper-v","tag-hyper-v","tag-security","tag-virtualisation"],"aioseo_notices":[],"aioseo_head":"\n\t\t<!-- All in One SEO 5.0.1.1 - aioseo.com -->\n\t<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Waiver: What you do following reading this post is up to you. 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